I mean, if by “going outside” you mean - “crossing the Israeli border illegally” - then yes. They will get shot on site. I still don’t see how this has any comparison with the Holocaust.

Ok, cool.

How does anything you wrote have anything to do with what I wrote? Like, at all?

Comparing this war with the Holocaust is stupid. Even if you ignore the numbers, the situation itself is completely different. Palestinians are armed, hostile and a threat. German Jews were just harmless citizens, some even being in the German army, defending the country.

Ah yes, because what we need is more hostilities.

Has 7.10 taught you nothing?

Username checks out.

I don’t think there’s a single person on the planet who doesn’t want Netanyahu gone from the Israeli government.

He failed guarding Israeli lives

He failed guarding Palestinian lives (didn’t really try tho)

He failed disabling Hamas

He failed bringing the hostages back

He caused Israel to be the most divided it has ever been, hence the most right wing government is right now in office

And all just to not be in jail. Fuck Netanyahu.

1. Palestine denies the existence of Israel, even stated by the symbols of Hamas and the PLO, coloring the entire state of Israel as their territory. Now, who actually has the right to that land? The ones who bought those lands in the early 20th century and got a majority vote of the U.N to their creation alongside their neighbours? Or is it the ones who objected since the beginning up until today that no jew can rule any part of that land? The biggest diners of the other side’s existence are the Palestinians. They have since the beginning denied the right for a jewish state to exist. Israel started to deny a Palestinian state to exist only after the arabs started an all-out war on Israel.

2. Terrorist state? What does that even mean considering they Palestinians aren’t their citizens? They’re a state who has very hostile neighbours right next to them, and that acts with aggression to aggression. No act of violence against civilians has been started by the IDF, while hundreds of acts of violence have started against civilians by Hamas (the PLO don’t directly do terrorism, but they pay terrorist jihad’s families for killing innocents).

3. Can you really say that Israel wishes for Hamas? Even after 7/10 can you seriously say that Israel wishes for such a violent terrorist organization to exist right next to their borders? If so then that’s some severe case of Stockholm syndrome. Yes, Hamas is simpler to deal with politically, but it’s so much more threatening and hard to deal with militarily. How are they supposed to fight people who hide amongst innocents? Hamas is probably the biggest headache to Israel ever. They ruin their relations with Suni arab countries, they make them look bad to the western world by making them bomb civilian infrastructure, and they actively pillage their villages for terror’s sake. Seriously, how can Israel wish for that.

Also let’s be clear, what Israel wants is the entire land of Israel, including the west bank, all under jewish control. That’s obviously their best scenario. Do they get what they wish? No. Do they work for it? Yeah. Can you blame them? Idk. Probably. They really should work more towards creating a Palestinian state in the west bank/gaza, but that could be said for the Palestinian leaders as well, who are still advocating for the entire annexation of Palestinians over the entire land of Israel (“from the river to the sea…”).

“I used the chad meme so I’m correct”

Israel mainly kills innocent civilians

You mean during this war or before? If during, then yeah probably (although Hamas won’t release the numbers of terrorists/civilians killed) But again, that’s just war, and war is horrible. We can all agree on that.

And about 2023 being the deadliest one - it’s so much more nuanced than this - it’s indeed the Israeli government’s fault that things escalated since it’s one of the most right-wing governments Israel has ever seen - and their lack of competence should and is blamed for the escalation and for allowing such a major attack to happen. Israel’s government has a lot to answer after this war, to a lot of people - especially to Israelis.

That is to say, the escalation in violence was in the west bank, not in Gaza. Gaza was a relatively quiet area for months up until the attack (except for disturbenceses on the fence which Israel stupidly disregarded)

obviously when people say cease fire they mean a real one

Then by that standard there have been 0 cease fires in Gaza since Hamas took over. Rockets are fired from Gaza at least once a year - is that peace in your eyes? Calling for it now after all those years is just ridiculous. Maybe a pause for humanitarian aid, but ceasefire? Basically giving Gaza back to Hamas? What sane Israeli would live in one of the slaughtered Kibutz while Hamas is still in power?

A failure. That doesn’t justify genocide of people

War != Genocide. They both have massive civilian deaths - but it’s an important distinction. The 7/10 attack does indeed justify entering a war - where sadly lots of civilians are killed. Poor Gazans have both Israel and Hamas to blame for allowing this war to happen.

a cease fire means no more dead anyone

On 6/10 there was a cease fire - that didn’t prevent Israelis from being slaughtered. Hamas showed no* indication of stopping their massacares. In fact, they did the opposite - they only talk about how glad they are with the massacare and how they intend to do that again.

Israel is perfectly capable of defending itself without comitting genocide

Then what was the 7/10 attack? Even with oppressing the region they can’t defend against such terror acts without their air force.

Do you seriously think Israel shut off internet to hide what’s inside? Do you know satellites exist? Do you know cameras exist? How in the world was that preventing anyone from seeing into Gaza?

Right now? Yeah, definitely they’re violating human rights. But what are they supposed to do given their history? Every Palestinian leadership ever called out for civilians to be "jihad"s (terrorists) and kill as many as possible. I was simplistic because everyone here on lemmy also talks simplisticly. Talk of no nuance and no faults on both sides, mainly say “israel bad”, “israel apartheid”, “israel should stop existing” - all while forgetting this conflict has two sides. Yes, one side is poorer, but that doesn’t make them more just. Both are wrong, but arguably palestinian leadership are the worst here. Being at a huge disadvantage and still choosing to fight a war they’ll lose, while in the process keeping their citizens poor. At least Israel evacuated the cities near Gaza, while Hamas blocked people evacuating outside of a warzone.

Oh right, it’s not like gaza had a democratic elections where Hamas won… (And then ran a coup murdering the opposition). Israel chose the (what seemed then) less of two greater evil. Clearly they were wrong, and they faced the consequences on saturday.

Oh so because the other side is weak they’re supposed to just sit idle when they murder pillage and rape? You’re disregarding all the brutal fights Israel has fought against its neighbours as “they’re strong so boo hoo”. They also have thousands dead. They’re also terrorized daily. Just because they’re stronger doesn’t make them less right. Again, they of course have a responsibility in this situation, but come on. Please tell me of any rocket launchers hidden inside a hospital Israel has. Blaming solely israel for the palestinian miserable lives is half the story. A big part of it is their terrorist leadership who take advantage of their poverty to promote a gruesome war they started (not talking about these days, talking about 48, where all the UN agreed on something and they chose to invade. Since then both sides are fully taking part in this war.).

So many empty hateful comments here miss the fact that 70 years ago was 70 years ago, and since then a whole new generation of people are living in the region. Israelies who don’t feel obligated to have Israel but don’t want anti-Semitism abroad, and palestinians who don’t mind staying where they were born, inside the 48 borders, but want a decent live inside of it. No leader from any place on earth is working towards them. Israeli leaders want the whole country for themselves, and Palestinian leaders also want the whole land for themselves. Neither is plausible without serious loss of life. So stop being so one-sided and actually acknowledge there are two sides to this conflict, and that all parties are reaponsible. Israel would give anything in the world to have peaceful rulers in Gaza.