I don’t know that he’s actually significantly worse off than he was before, but he may be heading to the point where, regardless of his health, he has lost the confidence of the electorate in his health.
This debate, and all of his post-debate has hurt him, surely. But its detached from reality to suggest that Biden wasn’t “severely injured” going into this debate. The difference was that we saw an energized, verbal, focused, able to maintain eye contact and remember the first half of his sentence Joe Biden during the SOTU back in March. Bidens debate was a geriatric who is clearly “sunsetting”. Bidens post debate interviews re-enforced that.
Biden needs to be leading by 5 (50-55%) in the polls nationally to demonstrate that he had the “confidence” of the electorate. He was leading by 5 in 2020 and barely managed a victory in the EC by 40k net votes. If Biden is at 45% in the polls, he’s not winning the election. Biden is at 35% and dropping.
Biden hasn’t had the confidence of the electorate, basically ever, in this election cycle. At no point has he been “winning” or even really viable in this campaign. This is just purely what the data show us. Its what Nate Silvers been saying for over a year, its what Ezra Klein has been saying for a long time. The apologists around Biden protected him from any kind of real primary, or significant criticism in what has been the most critical period for evaluating his sufficiency around him as candidate. We were prevented from doing the kind of due diligence required.
Main points, Biden wasn’t winning this when it wasn’t about his health. Layer in the appallingly clear indications around his health and extrapolate. Biden was doing way better in terms of demonstrating his ability to “be the president” with the SOTU back in March. Draw a line from then to now, and then see where that line puts you 3 months from now. If you’ve ever had an elderly family member “sunset” on you, it is like, shocking how fast it happens.
If actors want to have an opinion that’s fine. But commenting like they have any clout or authority to ask something like this? Screw that. I’m tired of the entertainment crowd messing around in politics.
“It’s devastating to say it, but the Joe Biden I was with three weeks ago at the fund-raiser was not the Joe ‘big F-ing deal’ Biden of 2010,” Clooney wrote. “He wasn’t even the Joe Biden of 2020. He was the same man we all witnessed at the debate.”
Biden is going to make some snide remark about him now…
Just like he has to every other supporter who didn’t give 100% loyalty forever.
Remember when we all made fun of trump for shit like this?
Biden is going to make some snide remark about him now…
“Listen, folks, you gotta understand, this guy, he’s just… well, y’know, he’s a real… um, like a, uh, y’know, a complete… ah, c’mon man, he’s a real knucklehead, can’t even… y’know, get it right, it’s just… malarkey.”
rich actor says something dumb, news at 11.
Fuck you George, I was tired.
I thought the people saying vote blue no matter who wouldn’t care who the nominee would be.
Nobody begins to tackle the constitutionality of Biden leaving after some of the primaries have closed. Every primary that has closed will not have had the opportunity to vote for whoever replaces Biden. The right will rip us a new one for installing a candidate without voting for them and for once they’d be right. With democracy on the line we cannot forgo democracy.
A contested convention, while rare, would be legal.
I’ve never heard of this. If Biden does win the primary would this still be an option or is it dependent on him coming up short?
There are no constitutional implications to a party’s nomination process so long as it doesn’t violate the law with regard to discrimination and the like. If Biden withdrew you get a brokered convention. If he withdrew after being nominated, the party’s rules would place his VP nominee at the top of the ticket (although ballots would likely still have his name due to state laws and logistics).
Who tf is George Clooney?
I’m not sure Biden dropping out is such a great idea. Biden has a lot of supporters among Democratic voters. I’m not sure there is another democrat with his same level of support. There were a lot of contenders for the nomination in 2020, Biden beat 'em all. I think there are a fair number of independents who are motivated by preventing a second Trump term, so they’d vote for anyone who isn’t Trump. Biden meets that criteria. I get why Biden makes people nervous, but who would be better? Who has the same level of support among the diverse democratic voter base?
Why don’t Biden’s supporters just VOTE BLUE NO MATTER WHO like they tell everyone else to?
Right? All of the sudden Democrats are really concerned about who the Dem candidate is, even though I thought that didn’t matter.
I think it’s the exact opposite. With biden or kamala trump has the best chance. Any biden supporting group who would jump over to trump or not vote if biden pulled out, I think would be minimal. Nobody is energized for biden, everyone is worried about trump.
If he did drop out for someone else, younger and able to speak clearly, I think we’d have a wave of enthusiasm. Imagine another debate with trump and a younger well spoke replacement, trump would be trounced.
Bring in any of the potentials mentioned (except kamala, I can’t stress this enough), and I’d feel way more excited for the election. It ain’t gonna happen now, but just saying. With biden staying in people are righteously nervous.
Did you watch the debate? I was all on board with Biden until he shit the bed. We needed someone with the stamina to stand up to Trump’s gish gallop, and instead Joe finally beat Medicare.
If he is on the ballot I will vote for him, knowing that I am really voting for his advisers and staff to run the country after 8 pm. But any of the names being thrown about that have experience as Governor or in national politics will be acceptable. Harris, yes, but also Newsom, Whitmer, and any of the others. Harris would be easiest to slot in, since she is technically on the same ballot.
Do you really think any Democrat in the country would say “I liked Biden, and if they get rid of him I’m staying home?” It’s more likely the opposite, that people aren’t looking forward to voting for Bide and may end up staying home instead.
Do you really think any Democrat in the country would say “I liked Biden, and if they get rid of him I’m staying home?”
I mean, yeah, I kinda do. There are a lot of democratic voters who don’t know who Newsom or Whitmer are, but they know Uncle Joe, the guy who was Obama’s vice for eight years.
It’s more likely the opposite, that people aren’t looking forward to voting for Bide and may end up staying home instead.
Is it? I don’t know.
Like you said, if Biden’s on the ticket you’ll vote for him. I think a lot of people will do the same.
The problem with this argument is it only works for people who show up to vote, and if the Dems don’t get people, particularly young people, inspired enough to do so, then they’ll lose. Fear only works as a motivator for so long, at some point, you need to provide a carrot and not just the stick.
The problem is (for me at least) he’s recently shown he can’t campaign like he did in 2020, and he needs to surpass that effort right now.
Did someone threaten to out him?
Aw shit, they’re bringing out the big guns now. Has anyone asked Noah Wylie yet? Do 8 out of 10 TV Doctors agree?
Maybe we can see what Val Kilmer thinks, also. To the Batcave!
Clooney is a non-marginal figure in politics. He’s very involved for an actor.
I know, but if it turns out that George Clooney was the tipping point, then the Democratic Party might be the caricature that the Right says it is.
Clooney, of all people, is one of the least objectionable actors to have a major voice amongst Democrats. The man is on foreign policy think tanks and is a longtime fundraiser and organizer for the Democratic Party. And in any case, this is on the heels of several members of the House and a Senator dissenting. It’s not like this is the first or the last drop of the deluge.
He’s still an actor. I rather listen to presidential historians, and political scientist. Just because he shells out money in a system that shouldn’t allow it in the first place doesn’t mean we should take serious anything he has to say
A smarter person would listen to people who have real experience moving the political levers. Historians and “political scientists” arent those people.
You know who one of those people is? George Clooney. He has gotten democrats elected to office. He’s done the job of picking winners and losers. You are kind-of an idiot to ignore first-order people involved-in-the process people and to weight third-order armchair opinions more heavily.
Clooney will actually move people to support or not support a candidate. Physically. He will go knock on their doors and ask them to run. He’ll give them the funds they need to do so.
(If political scientists are actual fucking scientists show me how they use falsifiability for hypothesis testing and then tell me which of their hypothesis have withstood the rigor of reproducibility)
Clooney has known Biden for decades and just a few months ago organized a huge event for him…
“It’s devastating to say it, but the Joe Biden I was with three weeks ago at the fund-raiser was not the Joe ‘big F-ing deal’ Biden of 2010,” Clooney wrote. “He wasn’t even the Joe Biden of 2020. He was the same man we all witnessed at the debate.”
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Ozma may be an anti-Biden partisan amplifying these calls for his own purposes, but these are significant voices. The fact that these dissenting voices are being raised at this point says that, regardless of what the ratio of political-theatre-to-reality is on Biden’s health, the electoral calculus Biden must make regarding whether he should continue running or support a replacement is changing.
Thank you @PugJesus@lemmy.world . I genuinely hope Trump is defeated. I don’t see that happening with Biden.
Liberal asks liberal to liberal because liberal news needs you to “look at meeeeee”
